We’re back with Scratch! In this episode, we sit down with Abey Mokgwatsane, Chief Marketing Officer of Investec, an international bank and wealth manager that’s celebrating its 50th anniversary—and still thinking like a challenger. Abey shares how his team keeps the brand fresh by simplifying complexity, focusing on consistent storytelling, and staying true to the heritage that first propelled Investec into the private banking space. He also explains what it’s like to join a new industry as a “super sub” and how that outsider perspective drives authentic innovation.

One of the big takeaways from this episode is Abey’s focus on “making the complex simple and the simple exciting.” Whether it’s building a brand around the iconic zebra or doubling down on Investec’s legendary service culture, Abey’s mindset proves that consistency doesn’t have to mean boring. We also dive into what it means to remain “freshly consistent” instead of “consistently fresh,” a concept that’s helped Investec maintain its challenger DNA over five decades of growth.

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/EGXZiOWQbsA

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) – Intro 🎙️
• (00:03:30) – Abey’s favorite challenger brand 🏆
• (00:04:50) – Overview of Investec 💼
• (00:07:19) – Building a challenger ethos in finance 📈
• (00:14:30) – Making complexity simple and simplicity exciting 💡
• (00:21:30) – ‘Freshly Consistent’ vs. ‘Consistently Fresh’ 🔄
• (00:27:20) – The ‘Super Sub’ approach to marketing ⚽
• (00:46:18) – Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Four Seasons (service inspiration)
• Adam Morgan’s “Eating the Big Fish” (challenger brand mindset)
• KitKat (“fresh consistency” in action)

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities to help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and in this episode he’s joined by Abey Mokgwatsane, CMO of Investec.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Abey on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

In this episode, we’re thrilled to sit down with Sadira Furlow, the Chief Marketing Officer of Tony's Chocolonely, an impact company on a mission to end exploitation in the cocoa industry. Tony's Chocolonely isn't just about making delicious chocolate—they're committed to making systemic change in the chocolate industry by producing ethically sourced chocolate and encouraging others to join their mission.

In our conversation, Sadira dives deep into the reality of building a challenger brand that's scaling globally while staying true to its core mission. She shares insights on how Tony's embraces boldness and risk-taking to drive meaningful change, the importance of storytelling in conveying their mission, and how they navigate the challenges of growth without compromising their values. One of the key takeaways from this episode is Sadira's perspective on being unapologetically mission-driven and how that translates into every aspect of their business—from product design to marketing strategies.

Another recurring theme is the significance of partnership and clarity when pushing boundaries, and how Tony's fosters a culture that isn't afraid to "call the lawyers" to make a statement. If you're interested in purpose-driven marketing or want to learn how to build a brand that genuinely challenges industry norms, then this episode is for you!

Send us a screenshot of your review at media@wearerival.com 👀🍫

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/1zQgayBpb7I

📚Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro
• (00:07:30) - What is Tony’s Chocolonely?
• (00:10:43) - Why is Tony ‘lonely’? 🌍
• (00:19:11) - Perception vs. reality of a challenger brand 🔍
• (00:24:03) - Creating bold marketing campaigns 🎨
• (00:36:01) - Tony's as a real deal challenger 💪
• (00:39:15) - The 'call the lawyers' mindset ⚖️
• (00:49:29) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Favorite challenger brand: Duolingo
• Tony’s x Feastables

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Sadira Furlow of Tony’s Chocolonely in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn.

Find Sadira on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

In this episode, we’re thrilled to sit down with Charl Bassil, the Chief Brand Officer of the BBC, a globally renowned public service broadcaster (yes, the BBC) committed to enriching people's lives through programs and services that inform, educate, and entertain.

In our conversation, Charl dives deep into the art of nurturing brands for the long term, emphasizing the responsibility of brand custodians to preserve and grow what has been created. He shares insights on how marketers can think like farmers, cultivating assets that provide value over time rather than hunters seeking short-term gains. We also explore the importance of balancing risks and opportunities in marketing plans and uncover the secrets to gaining more buy-in within an organization.

One of the key takeaways from this episode is Charl's perspective on how brands can make people feel like they belong, turning the "others" into part of a community. We also discuss the evolving role of CMOs, the significance of maintaining authenticity in brand messaging, and how to remain relevant in a rapidly changing media landscape. If you're interested in long-term brand growth and making a meaningful impact, then this episode is for you!

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/9B9DrYcWnaU

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️
• (00:03:11) - Charl’s favorite challenger brand 🥨
• (00:08:10) - The role of brand custodians 🌱
• (00:12:43) - Nurturing brand for the long term ⏳
• (00:29:43) - How to get more buy-in for brand ⚖️
• (00:34:00) - Making people feel like they belong 🤝
• (00:41:00) - Why the BBC is a challenger brand 👊
• (00:46:35) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Favorite challenger brand - Olly’s
• Episode with Boxraw
• Absolut Vodka

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Charl Bassil of the BBC in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Charl on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

We’re thrilled to sit down with Michael Katz, the CEO of mParticle in this episode. mParticle is a leading customer data platform that helps businesses unify and activate their customer data to drive better marketing outcomes. They specialize in integrating various data sources to create unified customer profiles, enabling companies to deliver personalized and efficient marketing campaigns.

In our conversation, Michael dives deep into the evolution of customer data management, sharing insights on how the shift from integration to intelligence is shaping the future of marketing. One of the key takeaways is his emphasis on the importance of building a strong first-party data foundation, which is crucial for businesses navigating the challenges of data privacy and third-party cookie deprecation. Another recurring theme is the collaboration between marketing and IT teams, highlighting the concept that "data is a team sport." MK discusses how aligning these departments can lead to better execution and more effective use of customer data. If you're a marketer looking to stay ahead in the rapidly changing landscape of customer data and marketing technology, then this episode is for you!

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/ECTN_VC5760

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️
• (00:02:28) - MK's favourite challenger brand
• (00:03:50) - What mParticle does 🚀
• (00:10:30) - The shift from integration to intelligence 🧠
• (00:21:50) - Navigating data privacy and signal loss 🔒
• (00:29:49) - Leveraging AI with transparency 🤖
• (00:39:31) - Collaboration between marketing and IT 🤝
• (00:39:55) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Interclick
• Apple's iOS Changes
• Google's Third-Party Cookie Deprecation

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Michael Katz of mParticle in this episode

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn

Find Michael on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

In this episode, we’re thrilled to sit down with Ben Amanna, the CEO of Boxraw, a pioneering boxing apparel and equipment company that’s aiming to revolutionize the sport. Boxraw specializes in high-quality boxing gear and lifestyle apparel, helping people around the world embrace boxing not just as a sport, but as a lifestyle 🥊.

In our conversation, Ben dives deep into the art of building an authentic lifestyle brand centered around boxing. He shares insights on community building, the importance of authenticity, and his vision for the future of boxing as both a sport and a culture. One of the key takeaways is Boraw's aspiration to be “the reason why the world got into boxing”, highlighting the significance of staying true to one's core values in brand building.

Another recurring theme in this episode is the emphasis on community initiatives like Sprint Club and Sparring Club, showcasing how fostering a genuine community can drive growth and resonate with a broader audience. If you're passionate about entrepreneurship, brand building, or the sport of boxing, then this episode is for you!

Join our AMP Community from this link 🌱.

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/RRm5Zv3oWCg

📚Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️
• (00:04:30) - Ben's favorite challenger brand 🏆
• (00:07:00) - The vision behind Boxraw 🥊
• (00:10:30) - Going back to authenticity 👕
• (00:14:20) - The role of content and storytelling 📖
• (00:23:35) - Lifestyle vs product brand? 🤝
• (00:29:01) - Influencers in the boxing world 💡
• (00:37:24) - Building communities to grow 🚀
• (00:46:45) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Fav Challenger Brand: Satisfy running
• Creed 3 x boxraw
• Corteiz bolo campaign

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Ben Amanna of BoxRaw in this episode

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Ben on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

We're joined by the CEO of Bespoke Beauty Brands, Stacey Tank in this episode. Founded by Toni Ko in 2019, Bespoke Beauty Brands, LLC is reshaping the landscape of affordable luxury beauty. The company blends its deep expertise in color cosmetics with the creative brilliance of artists like KimChi and Jason Wu, while embracing core values of creativity, inclusiveness, and self-acceptance. Stacey gives us a behind-the-scenes look at what has driven the company's success, particularly with the KimChi brand, which has achieved remarkable triple-digit growth year after year. She shares how authenticity and a commitment to building genuine communities lie at the heart of BBB's marketing strategy.

In the second half, we dive into the evolving world of beauty retail and how it's being reshaped by challengers & incumbents alike. Stacey explains how social selling is quickly becoming the “third leg of the stool” alongside traditional retail and e-commerce—a shift that has the potential to shake up long-established retail models. She also emphasizes the importance of maintaining a strong innovation pipeline to keep up with the fast-moving beauty industry. Success, Stacey explains, is all about finding the right balance between delivering short-term results and pursuing a long-term vision, while avoiding over-reliance on any single product or sales channel. This conversation is a must-listen for anyone interested in, or working in beauty, innovation, and community-building.

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/ecL1gOGWntQ

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro
• (00:03:40) - Favorite Challenger Brand ❄️
• (00:05:58) - Overview of Bespoke Beauty Brands 💄
• (00:09:25) - Advantages of being an incumbent 🚀
• (00:14:18) - Journaling and Personal Growth 📓🌱
• (00:19:03) - Role of Chief Transformation Officer at Heineken 🍺
• (00:29:07) - How to Achieve 170% Growth? 📦✨
• (00:39:00) - What Stacey’s Approach to Marketing is 📲🛍️
• (00:42:33) - Why Organic Content is King ❌✅
• (00:51:45) - Lightning Round ⚡ ⏱️

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Favorite challenger brand - Future Society
• Best brand campaign - Sloomoo

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Stacey Tank of Bespoke Beauty Brands in this episode

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn.

Find Stacey on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

We’re back with Scratch after the long summer break! For our first episode after the break, we’re thrilled to sit down with Andrew Davies, the CMO of Paddle, a leading payment infrastructure provider designed specifically for SaaS companies. Paddle takes care of the tricky stuff—payments, taxes, subscriptions—essentially all the payment logistics, so businesses can focus on what really matters: growth. In our conversation, Andrew dives deep into the art of building a brand-led B2B business and tells us why long-term brand investment is key to true marketing efficiency.

One of the key takeaways from this episode is Andrew’s insight on how B2B marketers can learn from B2C and lifestyle brands by focusing on people, not just businesses. We also discuss the challenges in educating boards and CEOs about modern marketing approaches, the importance of long-term brand investment, and the evolving role of CMOs as commercial operators. Another recurring theme from this episode (something that we’ve heard quite a few times now) is the importance of understanding the broader business ecosystem and speaking the language of top business leaders. We also touch on overlooked growth opportunities, the evolving role of CMOs, and how critical it is to align your team on messaging and the overall brand story. If you work for or own a B2B brand, then this episode is for you!

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/Jv422AbPnP4

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️
• (00:03:40) - Andrew’s favorite challenger brand 🏆
• (00:05:10) - What is Paddle?
• (00:07:30) - Why does no one care about demand gen? 🤔
• (00:10:45) - Brand focused data-points 📊
• (00:19:00) - Building a community of raving fans 🎉
• (00:25:31) - Under-considered opportunities to grow 🌱
• (00:37:00) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Paddle studios
• Represent Clo
• Hockey Stack - B2B Marketing Brand

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Andrew Davies of Paddle in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Andrew on LinkedIn.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

We're joined by the Co-founder of Hyrox in this episode, Moritz Fuerste. Hyrox is a global fitness race that combines running with functional exercises. Hyrox is experiencing explosive growth in cities worldwide, with participation skyrocketing to over 210,000 athletes across 30 cities in the 2023/24 season and events selling out rapidly. Their origin story stemmed from identifying a gap in the fitness market for a measurable, repeatable sport that is accessible to everyone. Moritz discussed the model his team has used for a community-driven growth strategy that focuses on organic social media and partnerships with local gyms. This approach has allowed Hyrox to educate potential customers about their new product while creating a mutually beneficial relationship with fitness centers.

We break down Hyrox's unique marketing playbook, which focuses on event-centric promotion and word-of-mouth marketing over paid digital advertising. Moritz explains how their long purchase cycle is similar to buying a car, and how this has influenced their marketing approach. He also touches on the challenges of balancing mass participation with elite competition in their messaging & comms. As Hyrox continues to grow, they're now focusing on maximizing reach through live streaming of major events, seeing this as a key channel for media exposure. Throughout the episode, Moritz emphasizes the importance of adapting messaging, trying new things, and being willing to make mistakes in building a successful challenger brand.

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/m8FSZUGMUP4

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro
• (00:03:45)- Favourite Challenger Brand - Automotive Industry 🚗
• (00:07:00) - What is Hyrox? 🏃
• (00:11:50) - Hyrox’s Point-of-difference
• (00:21:00) - Why Hyrox has never invested in digital marketing
• (00:24:00) - What actually worked for Hyrox’s growth
• (00:41:00) Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• CMO of Fever-tree episode - Jeremy Kanter
• Fever-Tree

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Moritz Fuerste of Hyrox in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Moritz on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024