We’re back with Scratch! In this episode, we sit down with Abey Mokgwatsane, Chief Marketing Officer of Investec, an international bank and wealth manager that’s celebrating its 50th anniversary—and still thinking like a challenger. Abey shares how his team keeps the brand fresh by simplifying complexity, focusing on consistent storytelling, and staying true to the heritage that first propelled Investec into the private banking space. He also explains what it’s like to join a new industry as a “super sub” and how that outsider perspective drives authentic innovation.

One of the big takeaways from this episode is Abey’s focus on “making the complex simple and the simple exciting.” Whether it’s building a brand around the iconic zebra or doubling down on Investec’s legendary service culture, Abey’s mindset proves that consistency doesn’t have to mean boring. We also dive into what it means to remain “freshly consistent” instead of “consistently fresh,” a concept that’s helped Investec maintain its challenger DNA over five decades of growth.

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/EGXZiOWQbsA

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) – Intro 🎙️
• (00:03:30) – Abey’s favorite challenger brand 🏆
• (00:04:50) – Overview of Investec 💼
• (00:07:19) – Building a challenger ethos in finance 📈
• (00:14:30) – Making complexity simple and simplicity exciting 💡
• (00:21:30) – ‘Freshly Consistent’ vs. ‘Consistently Fresh’ 🔄
• (00:27:20) – The ‘Super Sub’ approach to marketing ⚽
• (00:46:18) – Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Four Seasons (service inspiration)
• Adam Morgan’s “Eating the Big Fish” (challenger brand mindset)
• KitKat (“fresh consistency” in action)

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities to help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and in this episode he’s joined by Abey Mokgwatsane, CMO of Investec.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Abey on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

In this episode, we’re thrilled to sit down with Sadira Furlow, the Chief Marketing Officer of Tony's Chocolonely, an impact company on a mission to end exploitation in the cocoa industry. Tony's Chocolonely isn't just about making delicious chocolate—they're committed to making systemic change in the chocolate industry by producing ethically sourced chocolate and encouraging others to join their mission.

In our conversation, Sadira dives deep into the reality of building a challenger brand that's scaling globally while staying true to its core mission. She shares insights on how Tony's embraces boldness and risk-taking to drive meaningful change, the importance of storytelling in conveying their mission, and how they navigate the challenges of growth without compromising their values. One of the key takeaways from this episode is Sadira's perspective on being unapologetically mission-driven and how that translates into every aspect of their business—from product design to marketing strategies.

Another recurring theme is the significance of partnership and clarity when pushing boundaries, and how Tony's fosters a culture that isn't afraid to "call the lawyers" to make a statement. If you're interested in purpose-driven marketing or want to learn how to build a brand that genuinely challenges industry norms, then this episode is for you!

Send us a screenshot of your review at media@wearerival.com 👀🍫

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/1zQgayBpb7I

📚Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro
• (00:07:30) - What is Tony’s Chocolonely?
• (00:10:43) - Why is Tony ‘lonely’? 🌍
• (00:19:11) - Perception vs. reality of a challenger brand 🔍
• (00:24:03) - Creating bold marketing campaigns 🎨
• (00:36:01) - Tony's as a real deal challenger 💪
• (00:39:15) - The 'call the lawyers' mindset ⚖️
• (00:49:29) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Favorite challenger brand: Duolingo
• Tony’s x Feastables

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Sadira Furlow of Tony’s Chocolonely in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn.

Find Sadira on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024

In this episode, we’re thrilled to sit down with Charl Bassil, the Chief Brand Officer of the BBC, a globally renowned public service broadcaster (yes, the BBC) committed to enriching people's lives through programs and services that inform, educate, and entertain.

In our conversation, Charl dives deep into the art of nurturing brands for the long term, emphasizing the responsibility of brand custodians to preserve and grow what has been created. He shares insights on how marketers can think like farmers, cultivating assets that provide value over time rather than hunters seeking short-term gains. We also explore the importance of balancing risks and opportunities in marketing plans and uncover the secrets to gaining more buy-in within an organization.

One of the key takeaways from this episode is Charl's perspective on how brands can make people feel like they belong, turning the "others" into part of a community. We also discuss the evolving role of CMOs, the significance of maintaining authenticity in brand messaging, and how to remain relevant in a rapidly changing media landscape. If you're interested in long-term brand growth and making a meaningful impact, then this episode is for you!

Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/9B9DrYcWnaU

📚 Chapters:

• (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️
• (00:03:11) - Charl’s favorite challenger brand 🥨
• (00:08:10) - The role of brand custodians 🌱
• (00:12:43) - Nurturing brand for the long term ⏳
• (00:29:43) - How to get more buy-in for brand ⚖️
• (00:34:00) - Making people feel like they belong 🤝
• (00:41:00) - Why the BBC is a challenger brand 👊
• (00:46:35) - Lightning Round ⚡

🖊️Mentioned in the show:

• Favorite challenger brand - Olly’s
• Episode with Boxraw
• Absolut Vodka

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Charl Bassil of the BBC in this episode.

Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.

Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.

Find Charl on LinkedIn.

Say hi at media@wearerival.com, we’d love to hear from you.

Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

If you’re interested in learning more about marketing from successful CMOs, we compiled a list of the top 5 CMO podcasts to listen to in 2024; check it out here 🔗 https://www.wearerival.com/content-hub-articles/cmo-podcasts-you-cannot-afford-to-miss-in-2024